Author Topic: Chapter 45: discussion  (Read 19242 times)

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #30 on: January 20, 2016, 06:18:51 am »
Wait, where do we have a scene that shows her footprints? Also, I believe part of the whole invisible thing is solid-form astral projection. So, yes, technically she was there, but no footprints are likely to appear. Assuming Qtalda is even a she.

http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1995

...Oh, didn't notice last frame.

And yes, yes she is. But you're still a bad person.  ;D
« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 06:40:48 am by bulmabriefs144 »
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #31 on: January 20, 2016, 04:21:42 pm »
ok.  Just checking!  ;)
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Daisuki-chan

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #32 on: January 20, 2016, 07:28:36 pm »
The footprints could be anyone, such as that invisible guy that stopped Maytag from cutting off her breasts. At the least he's a top candidate due to being known to make himself invisible and watch important things, as well as claiming to work for the appropriate nation.

mittfh

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #33 on: January 20, 2016, 11:05:08 pm »
Just been catching up on the last few, what does Maytag's note in 2761 read?

"I'll do whatever it takes to make her happy [something] gold [something] promise!"

maddhopps

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #34 on: January 21, 2016, 06:02:08 am »
Just been catching up on the last few, what does Maytag's note in 2761 read?

"I'll do whatever it takes to make her happy [something] gold [something] promise!"

It's from this page of the comic

http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=403

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2016, 04:22:53 am »
Hmmmm. Even if it means cutting off a piece of myself... why that note, and not one telling them she's fine? Kinda makes me think she might do something drastic to get through the Dark Cell.
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #36 on: January 23, 2016, 09:26:44 pm »
The flashback to the note from 403 was to show how Crest would recognize Maytags handwriting in the note that says she is fine .

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #37 on: January 27, 2016, 01:26:09 pm »
Hmmmm... "Because, Fuck Men."

Not really an answer. But a very curious reaction... has she Always been a man - hater or did 'some' man hurt her? What I find interesting is that it seems among lesbians the frequency of man haters is often portrayed as high... yet I have never heard of mysogyny among gay men? I wonder how the actual facts fit this admittedly 'percived' difference... or if anyone has actually done any surveys on the subject?
« Last Edit: January 27, 2016, 01:28:06 pm by sunphoenix »
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #38 on: January 27, 2016, 05:23:48 pm »
Oh, I like her.  ;D

Sometimes man hatred has a source that can't be easily rooted.  I'm a trans woman, and I'm pretty firmly lesbian. It goes back to a time at daycare called the "Fun Factory". I blanked out the memory, but my dad sat in on one of them, and apparently whenever we did anything wrong, they were quick to blame the boys. I kinda get the feeling guys were blamed for alot, as in I got the impression that men were useless. That, and alot of stories of rapist murderers, I don't think much of men. Watching a few Lifetime movies didn't help. Plus, in general, I find women cuter.

http://www.xojane.com/family/i-was-raised-to-hate-men-and-now-i-dont-know-what-to-think-about-feminism

Personally, I think we are all bisexual at birth, and at a certain age our sexual preferences usually become fixed, with the exception of some people who remain fluid about their  gender preferences. A typical homosexual  learns to love men, but it feels like lesbians have a later age where gender is fixed, and have run into so  many horrible men they learn to hate them.
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #39 on: January 27, 2016, 06:36:47 pm »
I see. I 'try' to judge people on their personal merit as a individual and on how they behave with or without honor and respect to others differences.  Like in your  particular case Ms Briefs... I'm male firmly hetero-sexual and would never consider a transgender or gay life choice... but I see in you a intelligent and polite personality... so I try very hard to show no bias or disrespect to your choice... though i may disagree with it~ it is not my place to condemn or criticise any polite or equally respectable person who treats other with the same politeness.  One of my best and closest friends is openly gay... and though don't agree with his choice he is still a dear friend of mine whose life I would gladly protect with my own or even surrender my life in his behalf if it would protect him from harm.  To add to that complicated friendship.. he's Caucasian and I'm African American.  I'm well aware from my life experiences, as such, of the unreasoning, unfair, flat EVIL of bigotry... and would NEVER want to behave that way, to ANYONE for ANY reason!

I'm not perfect... but I aspire to see NO race, gender, sexual orientation, social status or, for that matter, species in the polite meeting of sentient intelligent beings in peaceful cooexistance.

Let Jehovah God judge.. he directs us to love each other as we would be loved in return. So that's how I try to live.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2016, 06:41:42 pm by sunphoenix »
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Daisuki-chan

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #40 on: January 27, 2016, 08:59:01 pm »
Well, it seems either Vennice is arguing in an extreme, reactionary way to get out of an argument she has no real explanation for or Vennice is a true man-hater for some reason Brion may develop in the future and/or Vennice is trans and thus reacted extra-strongly to avoid being seen naked and is so unwilling to share that she's trans that she simply picked another extreme to get out of the conversation (either part A is true or part B is true or part C is true or parts B and C are simultaneously true). Her being a random undeveloped man-hater is another possibility but seems even more shallow than her having no reason whatsoever for modesty. So I'm hoping A and D are not true and that B and/or C are true. Of course it's possible that B and/or C are true but Brion will kill her off or otherwise remove her from the story before explaining/revealing B and/or C in any depth, but this makes the conversation a waste of time outside of developing Regina, and I'm not sure the conversation did much for Regina other than cement that she idolizes Maytag and wants to be like her.

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #41 on: January 28, 2016, 08:47:33 pm »
I see. I 'try' to judge people on their personal merit as a individual and on how they behave with or without honor and respect to others differences.  Like in your  particular case Ms Briefs... I'm male firmly hetero-sexual and would never consider a transgender or gay life choice... but I see in you a intelligent and polite personality... so I try very hard to show no bias or disrespect to your choice... though i may disagree with it~ it is not my place to condemn or criticise any polite or equally respectable person who treats other with the same politeness.  One of my best and closest friends is openly gay... and though don't agree with his choice he is still a dear friend of mine whose life I would gladly protect with my own or even surrender my life in his behalf if it would protect him from harm.  To add to that complicated friendship.. he's Caucasian and I'm African American.  I'm well aware from my life experiences, as such, of the unreasoning, unfair, flat EVIL of bigotry... and would NEVER want to behave that way, to ANYONE for ANY reason!

I'm not perfect... but I aspire to see NO race, gender, sexual orientation, social status or, for that matter, species in the polite meeting of sentient intelligent beings in peaceful cooexistance.

Let Jehovah God judge.. he directs us to love each other as we would be loved in return. So that's how I try to live.

Oh, I like you too!  :-*

Basically, the odd thing is, I'm a moderate-conservative (don't vote conservative because I'm too far middle) Christian too, so I had a fair amount of angst about this for awhile too. Being trans means sexuality is all mixed up, so I'm actually heterosexual in terms of my original (?) gender, it's just that I don't really feel comfy with male gender roles (don't feel, lift this/that, be tough, fight fight fight) I have a need inside to be seen by others as something other than male.

Quote
Well, it seems either Vennice is arguing in an extreme, reactionary way to get out of an argument she has no real explanation for or Vennice is a true man-hater for some reason Brion may develop in the future and/or Vennice is trans and thus reacted extra-strongly to avoid being seen naked and is so unwilling to share that she's trans that she simply picked another extreme to get out of the conversation (either part A is true or part B is true or part C is true or parts B and C are simultaneously true). Her being a random undeveloped man-hater is another possibility but seems even more shallow than her having no reason whatsoever for modesty. So I'm hoping A and D are not true and that B and/or C are true. Of course it's possible that B and/or C are true but Brion will kill her off or otherwise remove her from the story before explaining/revealing B and/or C in any depth, but this makes the conversation a waste of time outside of developing Regina, and I'm not sure the conversation did much for Regina other than cement that she idolizes Maytag and wants to be like her.

I wonder how trans works in Flipside world.

And yes, reading between the lines, I have the impression of something like this. Not necessarily trans though. "No one gets to see this body! It's too good for them" kinda reads as there's something I especially don't want men to see, but I don't think women would understand either (covering insecurity with fake narcissism). This feels like either gender dysphoria or more likely she is sorta intersex. I knew a girl that now looking back on it, I still love her completely, but I wonder, since she did appear to have an aversion to swimsuits. I kinda wish I had seen her in one as she was sorta cute, but she was curvy and tall and insecure in other ways.
http://www.isna.org/faq/concealment
These are people I feel for, as from birth, people try to surgically alter them and they walk around with fear of being rejected. But I want to be cool with this.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2016, 03:57:04 am by bulmabriefs144 »
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

Daisuki-chan

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #42 on: January 29, 2016, 11:02:30 pm »
Intersex can make sense, but it doesn't seem very common in stories compared to trans, so it didn't occur to me. It would fill the same role in my possibilities as C, although it wouldn't be the same to Vennice, of course.

Anyway, I believe that surgically altering intersex babies must lead to additional transgenderism.

Stargoat

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #43 on: January 30, 2016, 12:05:26 am »
...and for the record...

http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1959

...I find Suspiria Terribly SEXY in her new horned form!  :-[

Does that make me a bad person?

Pish posh. Of course not. We all know you were a bad person well before finding Suspiria Terribly SEXY in her new horny form. Never you fret.

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #44 on: January 30, 2016, 03:57:50 am »
Intersex can make sense, but it doesn't seem very common in stories compared to trans, so it didn't occur to me. It would fill the same role in my possibilities as C, although it wouldn't be the same to Vennice, of course.

Anyway, I believe that surgically altering intersex babies must lead to additional transgenderism.

Ironically, it's done by the same type people who object so heavily to LGBT. They don't want to admit that such exist because it helps prop up the two gender binary so we have the whole deal with separate restrooms. But even if we didn't have intersex, even back in biblical times it admits to having "natural eunuchs". (It's a sore point, because it isn't publicly done, often isn't done even with the say of the parents, and is done too young all in the name of enforcing normalcy)
http://www.gotquestions.org/eunuch-eunuchs.html
 Which, ironically, since I probably won't do SRS (as much as a luxury car) that's what I'd become post surgery (cheaper option is castration of testes, plus hormones).

Anyway... if I haven't grossed you all out, this is consistent with the amount of modesty/shame of someone unwillingly different down below. This is why I discount transgender. They are generally okay with stuff down there, assuming they made the switch.
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #45 on: January 30, 2016, 01:13:05 pm »
...and for the record...

http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1959

...I find Suspiria Terribly SEXY in her new horned form!  :-[

Does that make me a bad person?

Pish posh. Of course not. We all know you were a bad person well before finding Suspiria Terribly SEXY in her new horny form. Never you fret.

Thanks Stargoat... just checking! :P

Now is it just me.. or does Moby look especially happy to have Crest putting his hands on her?  Crest seems much more relaxed about riding her carpet from last time {...er no pun intended}.  ;D

"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


mittfh

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #46 on: January 30, 2016, 02:26:07 pm »
While having a 'plug' or 'socket' is binary from the point of view of reproduction, humans have attached many attributes to those that aren't associated with the act itself (including many that aren't directly related to biology, e.g. hobbies / interests, preferred peer group, clothing / hairstyle choices). Pretty much no other area of biology / genetics is binary, but either has a range of discrete values (e.g. eye colour, hair colour) or continuous (e.g. height, metabolism). When you look at the range of intersex conditions, it's almost miraculous that over 95% of the population don't encounter any errors in the numerous steps required to convert karyotype and genotype into phenotype and biochemistry. There's an interesting school of thought that transgender may be a form of intersex, in that the body receives the signals to develop along one path, but the brain doesn't.

-oOo-

Anyway, back to the tale, and woo! Flying carpet!

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #47 on: January 30, 2016, 05:19:17 pm »
This is why I discount transgender. They are generally okay with stuff down there, assuming they made the switch.

Well, I have no idea what quantity or quality of change is possible in Flipside, nor what it would cost. Regrowing an arm or other body part that is intended to stay the same as before seems easier (from a genetic or "default state" perspective), less controversial, and more useful in war or other potentially dangerous skilled labor than relevant changes one could effect upon transgender and/or intersex people would be.

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #48 on: January 31, 2016, 05:34:58 am »
From a genetic perspective, if you are able to regrow limbs, you are able to perform a perfect sex change. By perfect, I mean normally the procedure is a simple surgery, and is more similar to carving a pumpkin into a desired shape than making something biologically work.  Because of the general shape, it will work as a sexual receptor, but it is completely infertile.
On the other hand (pffft, get it, the otger "hand" while we're talking about growing organs? Sigh that was unintentional) if you are growing organs, you are basically able to work with genetics and nanomachines to selectively grow one organ, remove the other, and attune the new organ so it will not be rejected by the body. This would also allow body modifications like wings or tail. You could definitely have a male become a female, no sweat.

But the deal here is unless her process was somehow botched, she would appear fully female after this, to the point where nobody would notice.
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #49 on: January 31, 2016, 05:31:40 pm »
You say "from a genetic perspective", but I do think there is an extra step (or likely many more) involved in not merely refreshing the original body part. You also seem to be thinking of real world SRS rather than creating completely normal body parts. I also don't know why you think real world body part replacement would require nanomachines...we don't need those for all the transplants performed today, so we should only need to grow body parts, which again doesn't necessarily need special genetic manipulation (in the sense of editing the original genes to create something preferred instead of the default thing) beyond getting the body part to grow in the first place (and since there's no genetic inconsistency with the original there's little chance of rejection). Of course there might be similar SRS in Flipside, but I was thinking about something more like replacing Maytag's arm with magic, which gave her a fully functional arm that would be more or less indistinguishable from her original arm. It seems to me that it would be easier by default to create a default body part than to just create whatever the body didn't naturally express in the first place. I know magic in Flipside could potentially do all sorts of things, but in practice you need skilled enough people to create and perform the magic, too. Replacing missing or damaged body parts with equivalent-to-the-original body parts surely has a much higher demand and payoff in Flipside than doing whatever random modifications, and should be easier to boot.

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #50 on: February 01, 2016, 10:05:12 pm »
Sidetracking for a second before addressing your latest post.

From Moby's narrative we have:
  • A quiet girl
  • Who becomes stuck on herself when she becomes powerful
  • Who becomes rejected and isolated as a result
  • Gets along with Kindred, but nobody likes her
  • People meet her parents
  • She hates her parents
  • She seems to be sincere

This is obviously the truth from Moby's perspective, however, as TvTropes points out, there is such a thing as an Alternate Character Interpretation:
  • Suspiria is naturally shy, and rather odd
  • Suspiria comes out of her shell socially. However, her personally is guarded so she comes across as arrogant and aloof
  • Who becomes rejected and isolated as a result. This probably also causes a backlash, which leads her to act even more rude
  • Gets along with Kindred, but nobody likes her. This is probably because Kindred sees behind the surface. Moby, on the other hand, is swayed by what now appears to be "her true colors."
  • People meet what appear to be her parents. It is entirely possible that either they move to a town nobody knew them, or dead ringers were assigned to replace them. Suspiria even says "so I'm not crazy!" as in, for years enough oddities about their behavior stacked up and she felt totally bonkers.
  • She hates her parents. Would you love random strangers that you suspected replaced your real ones, but couldn't even tell other people this, because they might think you are crazy?
  • She is sincere. She legitimately has been bullied. She has serious doubts about pretty much everyone she knows, and the guy she loved just died.

This isn't much of a stretch.

The sex change of the future would likely need those to extract the DNA of the host, compile a genetic 3d printout, and perform minute surgery on the organs and culturing of organs within the body. As for immune system suppressors. Well, there are problems with this. First off, immunosuppressants are essentially chemotherapy medication, given a much lower dosage. The body is not really designed for them in the long term. Second, well this describes the complications of immune system drugs during pregnancy, namely that the drugs interfere with the immune system. That kinda... endangers the life of the child. And the mother.

No, you would need some way of making your own organs from the opposite sex, and/or actually rewriting the DNA. Mebbe not nanomachines, but some sorta reverse gender cloning deal then.

 



"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #51 on: February 02, 2016, 01:13:15 pm »
Right with there on every point Ms Briefs... you were reading my mind! :)
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Daisuki-chan

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #52 on: February 02, 2016, 10:20:56 pm »
bulmabriefs144, you seem to agree with me that there is an extra step, namely having to edit the DNA. Regardless of what one does to avoid rejection by the rest of the body, whether or not this involves nanomachines, this alone makes it harder than simply replacing damaged parts with copies of what the original was or would've been according to the original DNA. And as I said there is more demand for this than for "random" edits, so between that and the default greater difficulty of "random" edits it's plausible that Maytag's healing was possible while things like sex changes or adding wings would be impossible or prohibitively expensive compared to the former. It's only equal and thus a given that since Maytag was healed anyone could edit Vennice or whoever easily if magic is so developed and commonplace that all sorts of extreme body modification would be common. I don't see a lot of people in Flipside running around with bones stronger than titanium, muscles that can throw ten ton boulders one hundred feet (of course you'd need better bones and other body parts for this, too), extremely fire or cold resistant skin, or regeneration that lets one heal major wounds in minutes or seconds without exhausting the person, not to mention new body parts like wings or tails, so it's easy to imagine that Vennice has either no or very limited options, assuming she would want to take such an option. For all I know Maytag's healing was already something only a very rich person would normally have access to, making "random" edits only possible for extremely wealthy people and/or rare, high-powered sorcerers, if anyone. We do already know that even lesser healing (such as of Bern's father) can be expensive, after all.

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #53 on: February 03, 2016, 03:52:50 am »
Well, actually one or more of those conditions is already met by Bloody Mary herself.

It is the same technology, but while sex or skin color changes might be justifiable (by the way, if it was prohibitively expensive, why did they act like no big deal? It's upper court procedure but obviously relatively simple. Meaning there are more complicated things, like regrowing a broken heart), I imagine there are arbitrary moral restrictions, for the same reason we don't walk around with cloned parts despite being on threshold of stem cell breakthroughs. People get squicked out by cloned organ so we're instead using dumb old robotic prosthesis (ppl are dumb, haven't you guys seen movies about malfunctioning machines?) .
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #54 on: February 03, 2016, 04:27:40 pm »
I said a lot of people...and there are not a lot, are there? Is Vennice known to be one of those people? And Bloody Mary must be beyond the capabilities of almost anyone to create, plus she has drawbacks few would accept. As for Maytag, she was helped by important people. And we KNOW other healing that should be simpler and in higher demand than what Maytag received is still expensive. Also, regardless of "morality" I don't see how Maytag's healing is in the same category as "random" modifications.

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #55 on: February 03, 2016, 07:39:36 pm »
Given what we know about the "magic" or technology of this world, it's not throwing more power at the problem. It's different application of the same technique. Regrowing limbs, growing wings, growing organs. Same difference all around. The difference, is that the Thin Man (or rather his backer) is a mad scientist. Same technology, different willingness to do stuff with it.

Bloody Mary is essentially my nanomachine design in play. Except they might be symbiotes or something. They detect wounds in the body, and horde on it stimulating almost cancerlike healing and regrowth of wounds. This is the regrowth technology as a constantly active effect. I am thinking symbiotes, because most of her other effects seem to be biological (the "fear demon" could easily be a type of ooze (read: low level lifeform)  that gives off some sort of fear hormone, and the claws are definitely some type of necrotoxin venom or acid). Given the level of science we are dealing with, all you would need is someone mad enough to do this.  Btw, the venom Bloody Marry has? I think this is not actually for her benefit, so much as a failsafe (where someone like Bern can kill her with her own toxin) if she gets too out of control.

Drinking makes everything better!  ;D 
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #56 on: February 04, 2016, 04:44:07 pm »
You call it the "same", but there's no evidence of that. To me it's restoring the default properties of something vs. creating something arbitrary. If everything was the "same" just because nanomachines can do lots of things then we ought to have more and/or more powerful sorcerers, alongside greater effects upon the world. Given that healing IS expensive and there don't seem to be loads of heavily modified people running around I can't just jump to wings and whatever being no big deal for any random Vennice or whoever wants them.

Your nanomachine design? What are you talking about. ;p In any case, there is a lack of hard details on how Bloody Mary works, isn't there? Perhaps it's one thing, perhaps it's another. When I said it has drawbacks few would accept, it implies that the exception (although I specifically didn't say there were none, so it's an exception to what's common in Flipside, not to the logic of what I said) came with horrendous drawbacks that wouldn't normally be acceptable to people otherwise wanting regeneration. And since there's no other example of high quality regeneration that I know of this means that all regeneration I've seen has not even been good overall, which kind of defeats the "anyone can have anything and therefore Vennice would surely have whatever she wanted" theory.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2016, 04:45:53 pm by Daisuki-chan »

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #57 on: February 08, 2016, 10:02:26 pm »
I am Al Gore. I invented the invented the internet.  ;D

(As in, the idea I mentioned earlier)

Recall the entrance to Eschelon.

http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1029

We had massive floating rocks, flying city, "burial" using magic, regrowing organs.

There is no sign of any limits to this "magic". For that matter, human being can be brought back to life (it's expensive, and some deaths are a no-go, but quite a bit beyond what any medicine now can do).

http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1037

They call this process "easy". If you had a model, you could definitely make wings. Or whatever else. Beyond that is mirroring, to make things symmetrical. Given this, the reason people aren't walking around with wings?

  • It's forbidden by law
  • Or it's extremely tacky

Given that some people have "curses" and other anomalies, there are some exceptions of this. But it seems like anything too extreme tends to provoke action from law enforcement.
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison

Daisuki-chan

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #58 on: February 09, 2016, 03:58:27 am »
I have no idea how many sorcerers may have collaborated to do whatever to Eschelon, when this occurred (or if it needs ongoing, possibly "expensive" maintenance), or if it's partially or wholly some effect from pre-sorcerer times (when nanotechnology may have indeed been spammed more heavily). Many nations today have aircraft carriers (which can cost billions of dollars each) and other super-expensive things, so even if something was "possible" it can still be inaccessible to Vennice for financial reasons, which is part of what I've been saying. By the way, the next page says the floating rocks are clouds, not rocks. ;p

Maytag's arm replacement was "mirroring" in your link. Good luck mirroring wings or genitals you don't have or that you want changed. It seems to come back to the idea that restoring a default is easier (although mirroring being copying with a minor twist makes it even more basic, since it would seem that if Maytag lost both arms she may have been fucked), like one would think it would be in a story. In fact since it's not based on DNA this is a bit difficult to make work for random body part choices...good luck mirroring some random wing or genitals that aren't yours in the first place and having your body not reject it. And even if you didn't reject it there would be the question of sensing and controlling the new body part properly...perhaps not so much of an issue with mirrored arms, but extras like wings or swaps of genitals may not be easy at all to make work as though they were your own since birth. So we can easily be back to no luck for randoms like Vennice (perhaps Vennice is wealthy or a powerful sorceress or has such friends, but I have to assume not until otherwise is proven).

Anyway, calling it "easy" is relative. Clearly that location was well set up to do that, but if Maytag didn't luck into getting such help how "easy" might it have been to find and purchase it? Obviously healing is not "easy" in some areas, where "easy" should mean cheap, not "we're in the best area with the most sorcerers and specifically have a set up for this and have done it over and over to the point where we can reliably do it well". Basically, a surgeon in a hospital might call some operation "easy", but is it cheap? ("Free" healthcare just obscures the cost rather than actually lowering it, to be clear.) If you aren't relatively wealthy (let's say you're a random peasant such as might exist in Flipside or our third world) what are your chances of purchasing this? Vennice might not be a random peasant, but if she wants something better than mirroring an arm she already has one of she might be out of luck, as the price would normally be higher, since it would probably be harder than "easy", and "easy" very probably doesn't mean cheap.

I see no evidence law enforcement is doing much of anything. Of course if you looked and acted like a monster they'd normally act, but if you looked "weird" but didn't do anything is there a reason to believe they'd do anything? And of course one has to consider where one is...perhaps the knights would be very proactive, but as I recall they don't rule very much of the total land in Flipside.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2016, 04:03:22 am by Daisuki-chan »

bulmabriefs144

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Re: Chapter 45: discussion
« Reply #59 on: February 11, 2016, 08:11:02 pm »
Meh, nvm. I think we're getting off story a bit.

Brion will probably explain sex changes if it's relevant to the plot, otherwise it's kinda whatever.

This is kinda a weird story, no? We started with a sense of mission then, nahhhh, let's go drinking. Meanwhile, we have wizard girl Regina getting a first taste of perversion. Unless it's filler or humor section, it's kinda "where is Brion going with this?" chapter.

 
"この世界の悪があれば本当に、それは人類の心の内にあります."
(Truly, if there is evil in this world, it lies within the heart of mankind)
—Edward D. Morrison