Author Topic: Chapter 41: Discussion  (Read 8137 times)

Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #30 on: August 22, 2014, 07:01:58 am »
Mama Crest, NOW would be a good time to RUN FOR YOUR LIFE! That woman (and I use the term loosely since we have no idea what she REALLY is) has no compunctions against murdering the parents of the person or persons she wants to control.

weirdguy

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #31 on: August 22, 2014, 09:12:38 pm »
might be a bit hard for her to run away

also, having invisible avatars is creepy

SAGG

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #32 on: August 23, 2014, 12:24:50 am »
Why do I think Q'talda will stop Crest from blabbing,  oh say, like subtly threatening his mother?   :-X

Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #33 on: August 25, 2014, 04:54:31 am »
Why do I think Q'talda will stop Crest from blabbing,  oh say, like subtly threatening his mother?   :-X
Q'talda won't be subtle. Mama Crest will KNOW she's been threatened, or maybe she'll just fall over dead as a "warning."

Best thing for Crest to say right now, "Mom. Don't interfere. This woman, Q'talda, has no reservations about killing someone's parents to then kidnap them, imprison them in her academy, brutally bullied or otherwise, and then brainwash them into her loyal subjects. Oh, and if their memories return, try to kill them 'as a threat' to her country. Did I get that right?"

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #34 on: August 25, 2014, 03:15:23 pm »
...uhm.. sorry... I keep thinking about how kinky it would be to have sex with an invisible woman!  Were we discussing something else? :)
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #35 on: August 26, 2014, 05:29:41 am »
Ok, their stunned reactions say that the phananx were NOT informed of this little detail. Furthermore, Crest is missing one minor detail. Suspira didn't kill the conclave, she didn't even raise a finger against them, literally. The conclave killed themselves with the backlash from Q'talda's own spell.

Q'talda's lack of reaction here is a bit disturbing.

SparcMan

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #36 on: August 27, 2014, 01:00:48 pm »
Unless there's some kind of verbal gymnastics involved, Q'talda's either lying now or she lied to Suspira, but it's pretty clear on page 15 of chapter 38, she states quite plainly that she killed Suspira's parents and erased her memories to hide it.
http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1963
Maybe the reasons are not what Crest thinks, but either she killed Suspira's parents as Crest says or she lied to Suspira (which she had no real reason to do at the time).

Also, in spite of her Dolly Pardon hairdo, I think Moby looks great.

weirdguy

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #37 on: August 27, 2014, 01:30:46 pm »
you linking back to that also reminds us of the creepy footprints, so that's one loose end tied up

wowfood

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #38 on: August 27, 2014, 01:34:38 pm »
Well, susperia was a lvl 3+ sorc, she'd lost kin, formed a rather clingy bond to crest and then began to transform into something far more powerful (possibly the work of the thin man, i'm not entirely convinced)

Maybe she was so powerful she began to warp reality around her, what crest saw wasn't the truth, but the truth susperia believed and then projected.  Who knows though. 

Maybe a damaged childhood.  She broke the all three barriers without help (if memory serves) maybe when she unlocked her powers, she accidently killed them herself and then repressed the memories and later on when unlocks power again, she blames her acts on Q'talda who taught her to control her magic. 

Maybe her parents were so afraid of her power the abandoned her effectively.  Many possibilities. 
« Last Edit: August 27, 2014, 01:49:12 pm by wowfood »

ducky_worshiper

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #39 on: August 27, 2014, 09:26:38 pm »
http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1591

I bet she's also the 'other invisible person' who had been following them around.

Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #40 on: August 28, 2014, 04:50:33 am »
Unless there's some kind of verbal gymnastics involved, Q'talda's either lying now or she lied to Suspira, but it's pretty clear on page 15 of chapter 38, she states quite plainly that she killed Suspira's parents and erased her memories to hide it.
http://flipside.keenspot.com/comic.php?i=1963
Maybe the reasons are not what Crest thinks, but either she killed Suspira's parents as Crest says or she lied to Suspira (which she had no real reason to do at the time).

Also, in spite of her Dolly Pardon hairdo, I think Moby looks great.

Well, there's obviously some verbal gymnastics going on here because the "Q'talda" in the flashback is not the same Q'talda we're seeing here because of her "contingency plan" to survive the voracious bacteria spell.

Oh, this is going to get real complicated real fast.

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #41 on: August 30, 2014, 12:35:03 pm »
Sigh.  You're ALL missing the BIG Picture!  Its much worse than you think!

Q'talda told Suspira she killed her parents... because THAT is what her parents wanted Q'Talda to tell her!

Look at the expressions on their faces?  It screams "guilty of abandonment" to me!  They may have had their reasons but I'll bet they are the true culprits here.
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #42 on: September 01, 2014, 05:18:14 am »
Sigh.  You're ALL missing the BIG Picture!  Its much worse than you think!

Q'talda told Suspira she killed her parents... because THAT is what her parents wanted Q'Talda to tell her!

Look at the expressions on their faces?  It screams "guilty of abandonment" to me!  They may have had their reasons but I'll bet they are the true culprits here.

That's not an "eyes to the floor, guilty" look right there. That's a "thousand yard stare." They're either meat puppets or mind-controlled.

mittfh

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #43 on: September 01, 2014, 11:59:59 pm »
Biological versus adoptive parents, perhaps?

Shazam

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #44 on: September 03, 2014, 11:50:58 am »
I've been upfront in the past where I liked where the story was going, and where I didn't groove with it, and at the same time have tried to be clear 'let the author tell their story' whether I particularly liked it or not. The main time I balked was Mayday's utterly unfunny confession to being sociopathic at the comedy competition. But again, I felt to give a pass.

I do like QTalda being alive. If nothing else, she'd made clear she was immune to her own magic. I don't like this post cliff hanger switch out of the parents being alive. I especially don't find myself interested in the needless switch out, or Suspira's 'affecting' the Conclavers. It would make even less sense with Q'Talda having an illusionary doppleganger. How would you psychically control Q'Talda from a distance? Truthfully though? I don't even care. It's too cheap a twist. This arc just makes me feel blah about Crest as well, which is a shame as he's a core char we've seen too little of.

I'll be back in a couple months when this has advanced a bit, which is the best way for a reader to deal with a story they aren't as interested in.

SparcMan

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #45 on: September 03, 2014, 04:15:32 pm »
It could have been a high-level illusion. I would imagine that a powerful enough illusion could make it feel like you were being controlled and being made to say things you don't want to. If that were the case, it probably would not matter if Q'Talda were physically there or not. She was there by proxy and would likely have felt the full effects of such an illusion. If the conclave WAS being controlled, then does that mean Suspira caused Q'Talda to release the flesh-eating microbes which she knew would then rebound onto the conclave?? That's big because it would make Suspira the murderer here. Nope nope nope sticking with the illusion theory.

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #46 on: September 03, 2014, 07:26:53 pm »
I've been upfront in the past where I liked where the story was going, and where I didn't groove with it, and at the same time have tried to be clear 'let the author tell their story' whether I particularly liked it or not. The main time I balked was Mayday's utterly unfunny confession to being sociopathic at the comedy competition. But again, I felt to give a pass.

I do like QTalda being alive. If nothing else, she'd made clear she was immune to her own magic. I don't like this post cliff hanger switch out of the parents being alive. I especially don't find myself interested in the needless switch out, or Suspira's 'affecting' the Conclavers. It would make even less sense with Q'Talda having an illusionary doppleganger. How would you psychically control Q'Talda from a distance? Truthfully though? I don't even care. It's too cheap a twist. This arc just makes me feel blah about Crest as well, which is a shame as he's a core char we've seen too little of.

I'll be back in a couple months when this has advanced a bit, which is the best way for a reader to deal with a story they aren't as interested in.


I don't know... but I ain't buying it.. not for exactly worded the same reason as Shazam... but close enough to not make much difference.  This is just too out there... sounds like a lie.  'The Devil made me do it', excuse is not working here.  I don't see Suspira's motivation behind forcing them to say crap that wasn't true... and then give Crest the opportunity to let her die if he felt she was too dangerous.  Such devious manipulation would usually denote some ulterior motive or need for Crest to be on her side... yet when this chapter opens.. we are led to believe Crest has not seen much of Supirira... if he was so important to put on this show for.. why is he not with her being used for her schemes???

I'm not buying it.  I think Q'Talda is lying and she certainly has enough magic to warp the minds of those about her.  But AGAIN..why all this show for Crest?  If she wanted something out of him why not mind fuck him too?

Not sure where the writer is going with this... but I'm not leaving.. I'll read and try to make sense of it.
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Lord Stone

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #47 on: September 04, 2014, 04:44:50 am »
It could be that Suspiria really did do it... but not in a conscious manner. I suspect it is the result of what has been done to her. The whole fact that her parents are dead could be an illusion, and the council admitting to murdering them a result of some unconsciously triggered magic. Or a third party could have been influencing all of them, Suspiria and the Council both.

Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #48 on: September 04, 2014, 05:01:30 am »
I have no complaints with the way Crest is handling this "revelation." It's perfectly in character for him, and pretty much for ANYONE who would get blindsided by this.

I DO have complaints with how the phalanx are acting. This is seriously NOT in character, especially for Q'talda. In order for the phalanx to be there at all there had to have been numerous high level correspondence between the phalanx and the knights, as such, Orangsong should have informed the Crest household that they were looking for him, and why.

Instead, he's ambushed by someone claiming to be Q'talda, and stating things completely contrary to what Crest, as an eye witness, both saw and heard during the Conclave vs Suspira.

I'm completely with Crest on this, this is just too out of left field to be believable without additional proof. Can Suspira's parents actually prove they are who they say they are? Can Q'talda?

Everything we've seen about Suspira's behavior prior to the incident was clearly provable. That girl posse she assaulted DID bully her, and in front of witnesses, which adds to her credibility.

Yeah, this is going to be a tough sell, Q'talda.

SparcMan

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #49 on: September 04, 2014, 08:27:36 am »
All good points. One more: we don't even have any real assurance that this really IS Q'Talda.
Either way though, I'm sure brainwashing magic isn't too uncommon (but surely illegal everywhere). Q'Talda's companions and even "Suspira's parents" could have all been brainwashed and led to believe a lie. Considering that Crest and Suspira are the only survivors of Q'Talda's confession, it would make sense to try to clear the Conclave of accusations of murder from the only surviving still-human witness. Even if he doesn't buy it, they can probably (try to) capture him and brainwash him too. They won't be able to do the same to Suspira, but it'll be easy to discredit her if she tries to make an announcement.

mittfh

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #50 on: September 06, 2014, 02:00:48 am »
A few wild theories:
(a) Suspira wasn't consciously affected Qatalda, but whatever Lehm did to her resulted in her doing so,
(b) Qatalda's permanent invisibility is courtesy of Lehm. We've only known her as the bandaged one, but perhaps in the past something bad happened to her, and her heart's desire when meeting Lehm was to be invisible.
(c) It could even be that the illusion statement was to cover up the fact she doesn't have a flesh-and-bones body any more, but rather a psychokinetic field in the shape of a body. That would also explain why she's immune to her spell - because her body isn't flesh-and-bones, there's nothing for the microbes to eat.

SparcMan

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #51 on: September 08, 2014, 07:07:35 am »
Either way though, I'm sure brainwashing magic isn't too uncommon (but surely illegal everywhere). Q'Talda's companions and even "Suspira's parents" could have all been brainwashed and led to believe a lie. Considering that Crest and Suspira are the only survivors of Q'Talda's confession, it would make sense to try to clear the Conclave of accusations of murder from the only surviving still-human witness. Even if he doesn't buy it, they can probably (try to) capture him and brainwash him too. They won't be able to do the same to Suspira, but it'll be easy to discredit her if she tries to make an announcement.

See? Crest agrees with me. Go Crest!

parameciumkid

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #52 on: September 08, 2014, 09:25:29 pm »
Magic isn't real.
Q'Talda didn't actually get killed, or kill Suspiria's parents. Rather, she was being mind controlled and it was all a lie.
Q'Talda dying was an illusion too. So was Mary dying.
It's all a cover-up! Really, Suspiria's being controlled too, and in fact all the characters, by a mysteeerious lobster god. And really the whole world is an artificial place the lobster god made up to make money!
O_O
Hi.
I've been out for two years, so warn me if I act like I missed something obvious. ^^;

...oh, and to anyone who missed me, I'm open to hugs, kisses, and intense tearful cuddles.

Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #53 on: September 09, 2014, 05:06:32 am »
Magic isn't real.
Q'Talda didn't actually get killed, or kill Suspiria's parents. Rather, she was being mind controlled and it was all a lie.
Q'Talda dying was an illusion too. So was Mary dying.
It's all a cover-up! Really, Suspiria's being controlled too, and in fact all the characters, by a mysteeerious lobster god. And really the whole world is an artificial place the lobster god made up to make money!
O_O

Thus sayeth the talking bacteria.

Really "Supsira's mother" makes the best case here. "Please help my daughter. You're the only one who can." That's, by far, the best possible thing to say right now. We can deal with Q'talda another time, and with a LOT more swords.

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #54 on: September 15, 2014, 03:46:05 am »
My "Bullshit" alarm is going off something fierce!

"Please help my daughter. You're the only one who can." ... sounds to me... 'please lead us to this bad-assed sorceress who can wack our evil assess cause we don't know how to find her ourselves!'
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #55 on: September 15, 2014, 05:57:20 am »
"You just want me to talk to her."

Yeah. That never goes well. At least Glyph is saying so beforehand. Not that I see Crest having a choice, seeing as he could be charged with aiding and abetting if he refuses, and GOOD LUCK proving your innocence in THAT kangaroo court.

Stargoat

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #56 on: September 15, 2014, 07:19:17 am »
Chrest is at home.  Technically, the Conclave has no authority there.  Yes, it's a technicality and there is likely enough firepower in that room to end a war.  But technically, Chrest can tell the Conclave to blow.

Azure Priest

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #57 on: September 17, 2014, 05:29:49 am »
Chrest is at home.  Technically, the Conclave has no authority there.  Yes, it's a technicality and there is likely enough firepower in that room to end a war.  But technically, Chrest can tell the Conclave to blow.

He CAN, but that would not be at all wise. Even if Q'talda is telling the truth, a little thing like "Law and order" won't matter too much to someone who can literally make it all go away leaving not even clothes behind.

sunphoenix

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #58 on: September 18, 2014, 05:10:32 am »
Chrest is at home.  Technically, the Conclave has no authority there.  Yes, it's a technicality and there is likely enough firepower in that room to end a war.  But technically, Chrest can tell the Conclave to blow.

He CAN, but that would not be at all wise. Even if Q'talda is telling the truth, a little thing like "Law and order" won't matter too much to someone who can literally make it all go away leaving not even clothes behind.

Nah, I agree with Stargoat.. he should tell them to blow!  Make them show their 'true' colors... which would only prove Suspiria was right!
"...no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free.  No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything - you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is Kill him." - Robert A. Heinlein


SparcMan

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Re: Chapter 41: Discussion
« Reply #59 on: September 18, 2014, 08:01:58 am »
Crest: Hey Mom, I should probably tell you; I have some good news and some bad news.
First the good news! I have a really amazing girlfriend and she's a powerful sorceress to boot!
The bad news is that she's turned into a murderous demonic monster and I have to go find her and possibly lead her into a trap. :(