Author Topic: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)  (Read 96341 times)

RoninAngel

  • Eternal Lover
  • *****
  • Posts: 2896
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #270 on: April 02, 2009, 10:30:15 am »


I like this chapter. It's so sweet.  :-*

And Maytag gives great sideboob!  :D
I got 99 problems but a nymphomaniac jester girl ain't one.

SAGG

  • Red Light Worker
  • **
  • Posts: 256
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #271 on: April 02, 2009, 01:07:01 pm »
Geez, and I thought Maytag was the promiscuous one.  ::) Look, Bern, your partner had done just about anything she wanted with anybody sexually, and you've known about it all of this time?  :o And you're okay with that?  :o It's like a wife that knew her husband was fooling around, but looked the other way because he'd eventually "get it out of his system", and finally settle down for her. I don't know about Bern, but if I'm completely devoted to my girlfriend/fiance/wife, I sure as heck would want her to be devoted to me. If she can't, then I wouldn't want her to be with me. But--if you want to be a doormat, then it's your call...  ::)

akashayi

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #272 on: April 02, 2009, 01:15:50 pm »
I just remembered that they're having this conversation in front of everyone else.

Awkward!

erana

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #273 on: April 02, 2009, 02:03:02 pm »
SAGG, you miss one point, a very important one: Bern knew right from the beguining about May's inclinations, but willingly started a relationship knowing that. Is NOT the same as a wife that discovers that her spouse she thought loyal is really cheating. Is like if you marry someone you know to be the son of a Caliph; you already know he might marry other women. (I blame Sierra for that, BTW). It's not the same as if you discovered it well after the wedding. On that, I speak from experience, BTW.

Akashai, yep, they are probably counting Crest as "one in the know", but even so, I guess that only the urgency of telling each other those things before the magic moment passes is making them speak in front of that arrogant brat of Iverness and that perverted pig of Glyph. Unless Bern is planing to simply beat the brat to a pulp as soon as May is no longer crying, and so what she hears now would be of no consequence :D (hey, one can dream. I know I would, and I'm a Good fay...)

LordKaT

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #274 on: April 02, 2009, 02:15:19 pm »
Damn, Brion.

I love you.

IN THE NON CREEPY WAY.

Well I love him in the creepy sexual fetish "going to tape you with a tire iron and a six pack of dr pepper" kind of way.

Miau

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #275 on: April 02, 2009, 07:45:51 pm »
Oh, man. This page. I don't have words.


I... I love you Bern. ;^;

tomaO2

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #276 on: April 02, 2009, 08:42:00 pm »
Hmm, guess I was wrong. It's so weird that she knew about this the whole time.

akashayi

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #277 on: April 02, 2009, 08:47:03 pm »
I dunno. I've had the feeling that she knew the entire time. There were subtle hints.

crazy_razor

  • Slave Groupie
  • *
  • Posts: 31
  • i feel like i can dream, too.
    • View Profile
    • Twitter
    • Email
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #278 on: April 02, 2009, 11:06:27 pm »
I dunno. I've had the feeling that she knew the entire time. There were subtle hints.

Yah, same here.
In regards to the newest page: AAAAAAWWWWWWWWH~ Bern!!!  :-*

Sidralma

  • Slave Groupie
  • *
  • Posts: 33
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #279 on: April 02, 2009, 11:54:15 pm »
Wow.. this was so touching. It's all the more poignant, I think, when the revelation is compounded by the reader's knowledge that this is not some silly phase Maytag is going through. It's part of who she is - as evidenced by her own admission on the beginning of the journey that her love for Bern was enough to inspire her to cut off a piece of herself. But that's got to weigh down May the longer she tries to keep it up.. and while Bern's clearly been willing to wait even her patience is going to have it's limits. Something is going to have to give here. I don't like using the word "compromise" because it implies that both partners are sacrificing something in relative equal measure. In this situation I don't really see that kind of "compromise." Either Bern will have to fundamentally change her feelings/attitudes towards sexuality or Maytag will have to. Granted there's certainly a spectrum of sexual behaviors and one could envision a situation where after one particular viewpoint gets it's way the person who "won" concedes something. For instance, if the relationship remains "closed" then Bern agrees to be even more open to new ideas in how they express their sexuality with each other to help keep May from feeling unsatisfied. Or in the event that May's preference "wins" & the relationship becomes "open" then they only include as a third a partner(s) someone/persons that Bern feels emotionally attached to/trusts enough to be comfortable being intimate with. But all these scenarios - in my mind at least - are compromises that stem from an original decision that isn't one. The relationship is open or it's closed. I just don't see a middle ground there... :\
We're all living in Plato's cave, and we've papered the walls with fictions.

Xshu

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #280 on: April 02, 2009, 11:59:31 pm »
Bern is awesome.

...No further comment.

Razzly

  • Erotic
  • ****
  • Posts: 1147
  • Contrast.
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #281 on: April 03, 2009, 12:47:05 am »
Damn, Brion.

I love you.

IN THE NON CREEPY WAY.

Well I love him in the creepy sexual fetish "going to tape you with a tire iron and a six pack of dr pepper" kind of way.

Me too, LordKat, me too.
Winner of Brion Foulke's "cute little panda"-award.
"Mutta rukous on vain mutina tuulessa, ei sitä kukaan kuule..."

rachel12

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #282 on: April 03, 2009, 05:02:18 am »
Wow.. this was so touching. It's all the more poignant, I think, when the revelation is compounded by the reader's knowledge that this is not some silly phase Maytag is going through. It's part of who she is - as evidenced by her own admission on the beginning of the journey that her love for Bern was enough to inspire her to cut off a piece of herself. But that's got to weigh down May the longer she tries to keep it up.. and while Bern's clearly been willing to wait even her patience is going to have it's limits. Something is going to have to give here. I don't like using the word "compromise" because it implies that both partners are sacrificing something in relative equal measure. In this situation I don't really see that kind of "compromise." Either Bern will have to fundamentally change her feelings/attitudes towards sexuality or Maytag will have to. Granted there's certainly a spectrum of sexual behaviors and one could envision a situation where after one particular viewpoint gets it's way the person who "won" concedes something. For instance, if the relationship remains "closed" then Bern agrees to be even more open to new ideas in how they express their sexuality with each other to help keep May from feeling unsatisfied. Or in the event that May's preference "wins" & the relationship becomes "open" then they only include as a third a partner(s) someone/persons that Bern feels emotionally attached to/trusts enough to be comfortable being intimate with. But all these scenarios - in my mind at least - are compromises that stem from an original decision that isn't one. The relationship is open or it's closed. I just don't see a middle ground there... :\

If you read the last panel again, I think that Bern knows its not a phase that Maytag is going through, I think she knows its part of who she is. During the entire last panel speech, she refers to a...uh...before fact? She says, 'I thought' or 'I thought you were.' Everything about the phase as she first say, is a pass-tense, and I think she did come to realize that free sex is just Maytag's nature.


charles

  • Harem Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 3603
  • LAWNMOWER MASACRE
    • MSN Messenger - charles_wilkinson@hotmail.com
    • View Profile
    • google profile
    • Email
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #283 on: April 03, 2009, 06:10:37 am »
*heh* She used the same reading trick in the whore house to keep her mind of the goings on there.

This whole thing is just going too well.  I'm waiting for the gottcha.  Something to spoil the joy and relief at all this.  The main one that hits me is that Bern may have an expectation for all Maytag's adventurous behaviour to be over now that its out in the open to discuss.  Which might not be too hard since May has already sworn to not cheat on her (or at least, do anything to make her happy).

Heck, it could just as easily end with Glyph crashing the carriage after now watching where he's going while listening to Bern.

P.S. is it just me or did that "I just met you to early in life" statement hit Suspira and Crest a little oddly.  Maybe something to do with their little bedroom visit.
CLAN OF THE CATS IS MAKING A COMEBACK! JUNE 8th.  BE THERE!

Kiran

  • Cage Dancer
  • **
  • Posts: 330
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #284 on: April 03, 2009, 06:45:32 am »
P.S. is it just me or did that "I just met you to early in life" statement hit Suspira and Crest a little oddly.  Maybe something to do with their little bedroom visit.
I rather think that they know about May nature more than Bern,and they know she will not change to monogamy even if 100 years passed...
I'm rather waiting now for May saying that to Bern,she finnaly should be honest with her,and tell her everything and what to expect in future.
But indeed if it was for Crest/Suspiria bedroom moment oddness,I wouldn't mind.
Heh Crest setting bomb at last page of this chapter "I'm not a virgin anymore..." with weak voice :P

Razzly

  • Erotic
  • ****
  • Posts: 1147
  • Contrast.
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #285 on: April 03, 2009, 07:59:40 am »
Mm. That face May made in the 6th panel there - she doesn't seem happy about what Bern is telling her.

But I understand her. Bernadette is saying that her wanting to have sex with others is just a phase, while Maytag probably thinks it's a part of -her- and always will be.

I can totally relate. Everyone keeps telling me that me not wanting children is just a phase, while I'm sure that getting children EVER is going to ruin my life. It's like a slap in the face to hear stuff like that.

So while I still think Bern is the loveliest thing ever, I feel for May. What's going to happen next?
Winner of Brion Foulke's "cute little panda"-award.
"Mutta rukous on vain mutina tuulessa, ei sitä kukaan kuule..."

charles

  • Harem Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 3603
  • LAWNMOWER MASACRE
    • MSN Messenger - charles_wilkinson@hotmail.com
    • View Profile
    • google profile
    • Email
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #286 on: April 03, 2009, 08:19:29 am »
Hard to say.  While I tend to agree that this is possibly more than a phase for Maytag we can also recall that she was once a complete parasite, stealing and cheating at everything.  But Maytag overcame that with time and thanks to Bern's influence so it was sort of a phase in the sense that she learned to live without needing it.

Maytag stated, before her capture by Bloody Mary, that maybe she'd had enough fun and despite wanting to do more, she could probably settle down a bit and be satisfied.  Thus, this could be the end of a phase in her sexual exploits as she learns to live without needing it... On the other hand it could be argued that unlike Maytag's thieving phase, Bern will need to work hard to flex on this as well, but not necessarily on multiple partners but on other things such as the drawing.
CLAN OF THE CATS IS MAKING A COMEBACK! JUNE 8th.  BE THERE!

SAGG

  • Red Light Worker
  • **
  • Posts: 256
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #287 on: April 03, 2009, 10:12:37 am »
SAGG, you miss one point, a very important one: Bern knew right from the beguining about May's inclinations, but willingly started a relationship knowing that. Is NOT the same as a wife that discovers that her spouse she thought loyal is really cheating. Is like if you marry someone you know to be the son of a Caliph; you already know he might marry other women. (I blame Sierra for that, BTW). It's not the same as if you discovered it well after the wedding. On that, I speak from experience, BTW.

Akashai, yep, they are probably counting Crest as "one in the know", but even so, I guess that only the urgency of telling each other those things before the magic moment passes is making them speak in front of that arrogant brat of Iverness and that perverted pig of Glyph. Unless Bern is planing to simply beat the brat to a pulp as soon as May is no longer crying, and so what she hears now would be of no consequence :D (hey, one can dream. I know I would, and I'm a Good fay...)

So YOU say. In fact, I think what you just posted is worse. "Well, I know they're gonna cheat on me, but I'm gonna love 'em anyway!" Uh, no thank you...  ::)

RoninAngel

  • Eternal Lover
  • *****
  • Posts: 2896
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #288 on: April 03, 2009, 10:18:59 am »
No one is asking you to go have a relationship with Maytag.  >:(
I got 99 problems but a nymphomaniac jester girl ain't one.

akashayi

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #289 on: April 03, 2009, 11:59:03 am »
Well it seems more like Bern is in denial when she says that May is going through childish phases.

But she's saying that to give May an opportunity to change, I think.

It's kind of an interesting mindset. I've come to realizations where if my significant other went and slept with other people I'd be ok with it as long as I could trust they would come back to me in the end. It's a different kind of trust.

Emp_Dragon

  • Harem Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 3229
  • Submit to the power of Sam
    • MSN Messenger - erik.arteus@hotmail.com
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #290 on: April 03, 2009, 12:08:29 pm »
It's kind of an interesting mindset. I've come to realizations where if my significant other went and slept with other people I'd be ok with it as long as I could trust they would come back to me in the end. It's a different kind of trust.

And an unusual kind at that. I have myself come to the same realization, but with the added request that she informs me of her interest in each new bed companion before she acts on that interest.

SAGG

  • Red Light Worker
  • **
  • Posts: 256
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #291 on: April 03, 2009, 03:20:39 pm »
No one is asking you to go have a relationship with Maytag.  >:(

Pardon, but is that directed at me?  ???

LordKaT

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #292 on: April 03, 2009, 03:36:53 pm »
Everything is directed at you. Now go make us some more pancakes.

erana

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #293 on: April 03, 2009, 06:19:08 pm »
Well it seems more like Bern is in denial when she says that May is going through childish phases.
But she's saying that to give May an opportunity to change, I think.

I don't quite think she's into denial; I'd rather think she knows her perfectly, better than us. I think, she is not implying Maytag's nymphomania it's a "childish phase"; just that, the same that people matures and their tastes change, she hopes May will grow and learn to direct her sex and afection drive only at he, instead of at basically anyone. I mean, c'mon, guys! We do have "outside knowdledge" that this actually happens to be the case with Maytag, and we also know Lady Bernadette is the Great Mistress of the art and science of analysing any situation at a single glance, including people's motivations.

I'd say, Akashayi, that our best bet is that Bern simply deducted correctly that at some point Maytag would have the conversation we know she had with herself on that bridge, right before she was attacked by Mary. 

Even more, the events of Solstice and their conversation about the portrait, plus Bern's presence in Kin's fateful fight, armed and fully dressed (if she had just taken her swords and run to help when hearing the fight, she would not be wearing her scarf and cloack; for the looks of it, she was taking a stroll, probably looking for May, maybe even returning from the bridge as this couple has a pechant for bridges!), all those things together maybe, (up to here I'm quite sure; here I'm guesing) just maybe mean that Bern guessed Maytag would be about to take that decission "about any time now".

erana

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #294 on: April 03, 2009, 06:30:46 pm »
SAGG, you miss one point, a very important one: Bern knew right from the beguining about May's inclinations, but willingly started a relationship knowing that. Is NOT the same as a wife that discovers that her spouse she thought loyal is really cheating. Is like if you marry someone you know to be the son of a Caliph; you already know he might marry other women. (I blame Sierra for that, BTW). It's not the same as if you discovered it well after the wedding. On that, I speak from experience, BTW.


So YOU say. In fact, I think what you just posted is worse. "Well, I know they're gonna cheat on me, but I'm gonna love 'em anyway!" Uh, no thank you...  ::)

I hope you are talking about Maytag and not about my spouse, or I will beat you to a pulp, son. Know that the Prince of Shapeir has NEVER, EVER cheated upon one of his three wifes. He maybe polygamous (I blame Sierra for that, again!) but he is a thrustworthy hero.

Besides, if you are so uptight regarding unconventional love relationships, what in Hell are you doing reading a saucy comic about a LESBIAN COUPLE?? It seems you are, perhaps, a bit confused. If you need help, uh, ssorting out your feelings, we can help you: my Prince still has room for one more wife (basic math, 4-3=1), and you could fit as that fourth to learn a few things. Oh, in case you are not a real woman, worry not, darling; Silmaria is so similar to classical Greece that the neighbours wouldn't be offended if you scream too much while receiving love  ;)

SAGG

  • Red Light Worker
  • **
  • Posts: 256
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #295 on: April 03, 2009, 06:40:22 pm »
SAGG, you miss one point, a very important one: Bern knew right from the beguining about May's inclinations, but willingly started a relationship knowing that. Is NOT the same as a wife that discovers that her spouse she thought loyal is really cheating. Is like if you marry someone you know to be the son of a Caliph; you already know he might marry other women. (I blame Sierra for that, BTW). It's not the same as if you discovered it well after the wedding. On that, I speak from experience, BTW.


So YOU say. In fact, I think what you just posted is worse. "Well, I know they're gonna cheat on me, but I'm gonna love 'em anyway!" Uh, no thank you...  ::)

I hope you are talking about Maytag and not about my spouse, or I will beat you to a pulp, son. Know that the Prince of Shapeir has NEVER, EVER cheated upon one of his three wifes. He maybe polygamous (I blame Sierra for that, again!) but he is a thrustworthy hero.

Besides, if you are so uptight regarding unconventional love relationships, what in Hell are you doing reading a saucy comic about a LESBIAN COUPLE?? It seems you are, perhaps, a bit confused. If you need help, uh, ssorting out your feelings, we can help you: my Prince still has room for one more wife (basic math, 4-3=1), and you could fit as that fourth to learn a few things. Oh, in case you are not a real woman, worry not, darling; Silmaria is so similar to classical Greece that the neighbours wouldn't be offended if you scream too much while receiving love  ;)

That's cute, trying to insult my opinion, which I have a right to give as much as you do yours, while ending it with a smile. Let's get something straight: I'm not talking about any lesbian relationships. I couldn't care less about lesbian relationships. I'm talking about relationships, period. I don't care about who has what wives, husbands, or live in lovers, in whatever fictional story you're talking about. I'm simply talking about a relationship between two people, where one partner's aware of the other partner cheating on them, and looking the other way.

Quite frankly, you should respect other people's opinions, and stop mocking them. What do you think, Brion? Am I out of line, here?  ???

Brion Foulke

  • Administrator
  • Experimental
  • *****
  • Posts: 827
    • AOL Instant Messenger - flipsider99
    • View Profile
    • www.flipsidecomics.com
    • Email
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #296 on: April 03, 2009, 07:59:33 pm »
No SAGG, you are not out of line.  I think Erana is trying to be cute, (Prince of Shapeir?) but Erena, please cut it out and be more respectful.

SAGG

  • Red Light Worker
  • **
  • Posts: 256
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #297 on: April 03, 2009, 08:03:40 pm »
No SAGG, you are not out of line.  I think Erana is trying to be cute, (Prince of Shapeir?) but Erena, please cut it out and be more respectful.

Thank you.

Xshu

  • Guest
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #298 on: April 03, 2009, 09:35:26 pm »
Quote
The main one that hits me is that Bern may have an expectation for all Maytag's adventurous behaviour to be over now that its out in the open to discuss.
I just sort of assumed this went without saying. Is it even possible that this isn't the case? I mean, even if she is being forgiving, she's gone on record time and again saying she wants a monogamous relationship, and now she's saying the thought of May cheating on her was painful. Her idea of a compromise is letting May be drawn naked "maybe".

Quote
I rather think that they know about May nature more than Bern,and they know she will not change to monogamy even if 100 years passed...

That's a little extreme. Even May says she could change when she's talking to Crest. The question is whether she really wants to or not.

Quote
I can totally relate. Everyone keeps telling me that me not wanting children is just a phase, while I'm sure that getting children EVER is going to ruin my life. It's like a slap in the face to hear stuff like that.
It is, but as annoying as it is, people who say things are a phase are often right. The vast majority of women I've met who've had children said they didn't want kids when they were younger but that they were glad to have had them now. All teenagers I've met who were depressed or said they'd be goths/punks/skaters/nerds for life have almost all grown out of it. I'm sure we've all seen relationships that were just phases. Phases happen, even if nobody likes to admit it while it's happening to them.

Quote
I don't quite think she's into denial; I'd rather think she knows her perfectly, better than us.
This.

Razzly

  • Erotic
  • ****
  • Posts: 1147
  • Contrast.
    • View Profile
Re: Chapter 20: Discussion (Part 2)
« Reply #299 on: April 04, 2009, 01:18:31 am »


Quote
I can totally relate. Everyone keeps telling me that me not wanting children is just a phase, while I'm sure that getting children EVER is going to ruin my life. It's like a slap in the face to hear stuff like that.
It is, but as annoying as it is, people who say things are a phase are often right. The vast majority of women I've met who've had children said they didn't want kids when they were younger but that they were glad to have had them now. All teenagers I've met who were depressed or said they'd be goths/punks/skaters/nerds for life have almost all grown out of it. I'm sure we've all seen relationships that were just phases. Phases happen, even if nobody likes to admit it while it's happening to them.



Yes, you're right that phases happen, and you're also right that many times, the people saying "oh, you'll grow out of it..." (I had my super-dark goth phase too, when I was 14-16, but I grew out of it) may be right, but that is not the point.

The point is, that it is extremely disrespectful to go tell someone who is (at the moment at least) dedicated to some lifestyle, and tell them "it is just a phase."

[Offtopic]
Similarily, I feel offended about people asking me when I'm going to breed, because (at the moment) I am absolutely sure I will never in my life have children. I dislike children - I don't see anything appealing about pregnancy, childbirth, babies, toddlers, children or bratty teenagers. And I shouldn't be forced to defend this view of mine. Why isn't nobody going around telling the ones that WANT children that "it's just a phase, you'll grow out of it and realize that children are no lovely little angels." [/offtopic]

Yeah, done.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2009, 01:22:37 am by Razzly »
Winner of Brion Foulke's "cute little panda"-award.
"Mutta rukous on vain mutina tuulessa, ei sitä kukaan kuule..."