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Messages - bulmabriefs144

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Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 22, 2015, 02:27:43 pm »
Have you considered counseling for your sex addiction?

Never even thought about this. It's an outfit, it's for fighting, we don't need to fixate on it. Gladiators are scantily clad because it's cheaper to do so than give them full armor. At a certain point, crossing into sex fetish zone and the fighters would complain.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 21, 2015, 06:52:34 pm »
Polly asked her how she felt, and she answered.

Also, again, she never asked this. She got outbid. Reread the thing. Even had she tried to do it, "nope, I'm gonna bid 10 for each you do, so you're hurting me." "...Okay I'll stop."

Bern seems selfish, maybe, but saying this would be so out of character it wouldn't be funny. If Polly was like "So not looking forward to spending time with a bunch of men/women/dogs" Bern would be like "There has to be some other way! You don't have to do that." As it is, Bern got outbid and threatened, so she's not gonna push the issue. Also, not reminding Polly of this, is kinda a sore point.

"I'm sorry you have to sleep with..." "^&#@*$ Bern, why did you bring that up?"

Also, I've known real-life escorts. I've almost been an escort. Being preachy and moralistic does not make you come across as unselfish. It makes you come across as a jerk. Polly chose this, saying this belittles her sacrifice.  I had a friend who did garden work, and she wanted me to help her hook up with a guy (bringing me along). I was like "fuck that, don't wanna" and she's now kinda an ex-friend. In general, yes, it is a sad fact of life for women. But it's something Polly decided.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 19, 2015, 06:37:40 pm »
"Keep up the good work, and you'll be paying down those marks in no time!"

Translation: "Keep fighting as well as you did today, and you'll be increasing our profits in no time!"

Yeah, 'Sex-plotation' is our business after all!  Nothing draws more audience than two sexy scantily clad hotties kicking Ass in our arena!  We don't Even have to pay you for the work... win-win-win! {At least for us the arena admins}... don't die ...too quickly! :)

..All of these people as Ass-hats!!!

Room and board is actually reasonable. In this day and age, we forget that these scraps of paper are only valuable if they add up to living wages, and many people are actually living outside their means.

Like ummm, possibly the arena guys. Sure they could be living in mansions, but seriously, I don't envy what they have to go through to earn it.

Remember, the definition of slavery is not "didn't pay you money" it's "didn't pay you a living wage and/or the work you are doing is such that you should be paid way more for putting up with it." Trust me, I've worked at places that technically did pay me but not steadily enough to live on, and the job was degrading. Still felt like slavery.

They still need to escape though, as they can't keep hurting people just to live.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 16, 2015, 08:10:14 pm »
Why do I feel sickened at the crowd's roar of approval for Bern's victory? What a bunch of monsters...  >:(

They didn't know they were trying to kill her.

There goes that theory. If the prison director is making such bets, then murder must be a known and accepted option in Marvolo. This kind of changes everything in the prison, and maybe town.

Where was Brion's post about what goes there again?

Not necessarily.. he IS the director and certainly 'in-the-know' of things going on in the prison... things the general public are not likely aware of.  I could see a private betting pool between the officials running the prison on special events.

But you are correct, this is pretty damning of their entire "justice" system...!!!

Bern in her 'crime' did not hurt anyone, did not kill anyone, and only intimidated the possibility of force ...Only to get a professional healer to heal on their agreed upon time that they said they would wait for her to acquire the funds to save a man's life...  AND simply because Bern refused to be their sex toy or maim herself or torture/kill another person ALL for their Sick pleasure... they decided to have a hit-squad of killers brutally murder her in a arena spectacle that they intended to make money off both with admission fees and side bets!

The Marvolo 'government' are the lowest of the low... a mockery of any real government.

ANY veneer of "rule of law" or legitimacy as a justice system is clearly a sham!  In my opinion Bern would be quite justified in just rampaging her way through them all and fighting her way out of there... regardless if they declare her outlaw!  Considering their "justice" system, or lack thereof... I would consider it a badge of honor to be declared Outlaw and Criminal by their 'society'.. if that's what you want to call the thuggery they are touting as a Government, Law, and Justice system!!!

Basically, if the government won't pay for healing and the government won't protect healers from being forced to heal at below market prices, healers will find their situations highly tenuous and likely will leave for better governed lands (changing jobs is possible, but less attractive given your investing into becoming a healer, especially if you can't hide the fact that you used to be a healer well, as then people will simply hit you up for healing on your new job) or will choose to not become healers in the first place, as it would be seen as a job for suckers that don't mind being robbed. In either case healing would become rather hard to come by if you lacked the wealth to personally hire and guard a healer, for personal or "general" (very expensive) use. Obviously the government is leaving some things to be desired, but unless there's reason to believe that effectively abolishing healing would push enough relevant people over the edge to successfully and without excessive cost overthrow the government and replace it with a superior enough one (I believe it's unknown to us whether such violent revolution is truly possible, as well as whether the new government would be better or worse, and by how much) it would seem better to keep the market for healing functional.

Uhhhh, just a heads up.

Unlike certain governments, they make no pretense at law or justice or anything like that. They are a constitutional anarchy governed by a commercial punishment system. It's very much a business, and everyone knows it. If you pay a commercial group to enforce law, they figure out how to make it profitable.

Government doesn't pay for anything. Because they have basically no taxes, and people do what they want. If there is a need (say, electricity) people hire someone to take care of it. Given this, yes medicine can be stingy, and yes there is some pretty sketchy justice system. Bern made the mistake of putting her norms into this. But it's not really subject to them. Mind your space, and it treats you okay, just don't threaten anyone.

Also, where's my mini-fridge?

The punishment is not a violation of the social contract. Bern used force to demand a service. Punishment was meted out. Bern agreed to the punishment. This is all reasonable and thus far she has no cause for complaint.

The problem is in the manner in which the punishment was meted out. Bern broke the rules of the jail by refusing to fight. What did she think was going to happen? It's foolishness. But the rabid response by the authority, including the attempt on Bern's life, violates the agreed upon terms. That was a murder attempt by authority against Bern. No one in authority seems to have worked to avoid it.

Bern has a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. In commission of her crime, she stole someone else's right to liberty and pursuit of happiness. Therefore, it is natural that hers be revoked for a little while. That was just. Bern agreed to the terms of her captivity. She could have languored in prison, instead chose to be a part of the arena. But the attempt at murder violated the social contract. Bern and those who support her cause have the right to violently oppose this authority (in a manner consistent with preserving the natural rights of others) until the conditions have been rectified.

This is all very interesting, but these rights can be suppressed (not revoked, mind, not while you live). If you are a prisoner, you are not free, and largely cannot pursue happiness. So you effectively have to earn your freedom. Given this, it is not reasonable to assume that life is guaranteed. It isn't that they are trying to kill her so much as they don't care enough to stop her from dying at bottom D rank.

This is not the US, it's more like the Roman Empire, minus centralized power.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 12, 2015, 09:22:32 pm »
Let's think about boxing. It's not set up as a bloodsport per se. But because of the better culture, it becomes extremely corrupt. Not only that, because blows to the head are not discouraged (well, it involves a knockout, rather than like sumo a simple ringout, and while you could in theory knock someone out through body blows, the results in long term might be internal bleeding), it is easy to over time crush someone brains out. This is a sport with known potential for corruption.

Or football, where 300+ lb guys are encouraged to tackle (pinning would be alot safer) meaning a high-speed impact with 300 lb of weight. These might as well be human cars. To say nothing of also extreme brain injuries because of the extremely hard helmets (what was wrong with leather headgear again? Seriously). This is a sport where there might be corruption, but we would not know about it from the setup.

The audience doesn't think about the lethal aspects of the event, if it's not commonplace. If it is commonplace, they can become desensitized to it. But in the cause that it is rare, there is such a thing as a planned accident.

Let's use football as an example again. Suppose a player was really unpopular, some idealist type that made a lot of changes and upgrades to the sport. The teammates love them, the audience doesn't know about this, and the officials hate them. Under family-friendly rules, let's say the teams are paid money to arrange a little "accident". Sometime during the 3rd quarter, the player has the ball after being hiked back, and is preparing to throw it. Instead of guarding the player, the team fans out, as if preparing to catch the pass (but in fact, leaving that player completely  open) while they figure out who to throw it to. In comes the other team, slamming together against this player. From the audience's perspective, it's a bad play. They don't think "that guy is going home in a body bag."

I don't know that it's to that point yet, but still...

So back to the "games". We know that this country, because there are no taxes, everything including basic utilities is run by business. We also know that it is a constitutional anarchy. The games, then, are every bit as corrupt as boxing, and worse, the audience is probably told that the players are healed after every game, and repeatedly told about the penalty (as in, propaganda that the games are safe). Whether people are alive and wounded, or very clearly dead, they are likely walked off the field in much the same way so as the audience sees what they expect to see, not someone killed because they were a trouble maker, but X fighter beat Y in battle, so rather than a bloodfest, they just think of it as an exciting fight.

There is also the fact that there is the "no force" culture. You can conceivably have that, but there are certain side effects, like that some violent drives get pushed into the background and people subconsciously crave things like gore and rape. That is, without reasonable situations where people would fight to defend themselves (think about Bern's original situation, and how she was basically not even allowed to threaten the guy), the outlet for some of their flight or fight hormones manifests in weird ways.

Hopefully, between her dad betting on her, and possibly the warden betting on her, her debt can be paid off. Otherwise, I don't know how she'd hold up in future battles, except against opponents that didn't understand her sword. Hopefully, she can use the downtime to figure out more of what it does.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 10, 2015, 09:12:43 am »
Modes? This isn't digimon.  ;D His sword just had a stun effect for the flat of the blade.

That said you have a point (also, in the portion above, the Warden actually has had her back, as she pulled some strings to get her the swords and the battle; it's just she has a narrow view), as from studying how these swords work, I have a pretty good idea how they work.

It's called transference. They aren't antimagic so much as able to transfer heat, cold, force, physical power, etc. Given this, I bet if she wanted to, she could use them as healing swords (by transferring injuries to herself, though). And I'm sure there are other things she can do. It probably can "dispel" magical weapons (by pulling the magical power from the weapon, and having it on short-term storage). And it probably can cut through magical forcefields.

Bern would probably be okay with sex with Polly, but thankfully not random strangers. That said, I think Bern has a strong need right now to remain faithful. It's one of those things couples discuss together, because cheating is not okay, but May might be open for a threesome if asked.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 09, 2015, 12:16:12 pm »
Yay! Battle won!

Two worries though...

One, the crowd may call for blood in order for her to get A rank.

Two, I'm not clear how the bidding went on those handicaps. As in, Warden said something about how all previous bets are in place or something. Does that mean that while Polly outbidded her, she also has to spend a few nights with strangers? Or is it all on Polly?

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 04, 2015, 06:56:46 am »
I honestly don't know if what the warden is assuming is true, but her analytical thinking (and assumption) is impressive. I'll make yet another bold prediction down the line: Bern and the warden WILL do battle for Bern's (and quite possible Polly's) freedom. Whether or not Bern tries to escape now, or later. And it will be a battle of epic Flipside proportions, possibly the greatest battle of Bern's life...  ;D

I thought so too. I also think that the Warden's filter of how events were will give her an advantage in said battle. The bruiser she's fighting now figured out what's up, and this is precisely why the battle is so hard (plus his crazy determination). The Warden sees it as a hot sword, because she has a filter around what Bern can and can't do, and has been consistently seeing Bern as just fighting well, yet not seeing the reality of what is happening. When she gets outmatched, her filter sees "just as I thought, she isn't a real warrior." Bern proved her wrong, and rather than admit it, "Oh she got lucky and/or planned this." Maybe she isn't a "real" warrior, but she can hold her own. It isn't that the Warden underestimates her though, but rather, she completely sees her as worthy and simultaneously completely missed this battle because she knows the swords are magical but doesn't understand them.

Fact: She was not in contact with the sword for long enough for it to still be hot, and if it was, it would have conducted into the weapon when she blocked it. Not to mention burning her hands. Fact: Her swords actual power is to take the force with one sword, and transfer it into another. Fact: None of this is shown in the previous comics (I checked) meaning Warden is taking minute details and spinning it to match what she saw.

That is, the "hot" sword was actually giving pain that he was giving her. But, what the audience is explaining it as (since they're far away and can't see directly, and because filtering it another way is at odds with their understanding of how magic works) is as a "hot" sword. Or maybe Bern is wrong about the sword. Truth is in eye of the beholder, I guess.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 03, 2015, 06:19:30 am »
Lolwut?  ??? I don't even remember that event. She touched the ball for all of two seconds while on the ground.

I think she completely failed to realize what this sword does from where she sits, and made a screwy assumption.  Also, that moment  totally looks planned, right?!? (Wrong, starting with her "planning" on getting choked to death)  ;D

Which kind of defines the situation, from where the audience sits they probably see her having a really strong sword, and are filling in the gaps with their assumptions (I wonder what they saw when the sword mirror-swapped those two spells). It's all about perspective and assumptions.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 02, 2015, 11:20:59 am »
It's actually simple physics.

The guy is holding her. One sword is embedded inside, he chokes her and applies force. Her sword touches him and "burns" him (actually what is happening is more like a super-strong arm grab to his arm, breaking his grip). He lets go. Now here's where physics comes in. She's effectively using leverage/momentum/gravity to push her leg against him. This is not a kick, this is a "my sword is stuck inside you, so I'm using my feet to lean against you to pull the sword out." Note that she showed her foot pressing flatly against is chest, near the sword. This is exactly what's happening, she's pressing against him to pull her sword out. The sudden loss of suction as the sword comes out is knocking him off balance, not her strength. This is also what is causing a massive amount of blood to fly out. Consider it like this, the sword was attached to his body like a giant sideways T, she pulls the line out, and he falls over because he's not attached to her anymore. Effectively, even if she exerts no strength, leaning on the sword like that is 125 lb or so of weight.


Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 01, 2015, 06:32:54 pm »
Welp, everyone called it wrong, no dismemberment (not sure if that refers to hands, or organs).

But she did get to kick him away.

And blow the Warden's mind.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 01, 2015, 09:00:51 am »
Fair enough.  :-X

More seriously, hopefully this will end soon, and Bern will move on. Battle is too long.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: June 01, 2015, 01:20:09 am »
More like Black Knight jokes. Seriously, did Brion stay up watching Monty Python? I imagine him biting her next.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 30, 2015, 04:22:59 pm »
Limbs can easily be stapled back on, as established with may, but I haven't seen the dead brought back to life in flipside yet.

I guess you forgot that part.

Also, the author apparently doesn't understand medicine. Heart wounds are not automatically fatal.

Hey, Warden is the one who said it, not me!  Perhaps SHE is the one who doesn't understand medicine.

Not dying immediately, so... Also, there's the whole concept of bleeding out.

But nice save.  ;D

It sorta begs the question with the warden though. Supposedly, when one pays off the debt, they're free to go. But I have a feeling (based on what's happening with these three) that this is a pretty rigged game. So I wonder if the reason Warden's so downer is that she's stuck here. That she was prisoner, but ummm circumstances happened, and she wound up staying. It almost seems like the reason she gave those swords is that she wants Bern to prove her wrong.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 28, 2015, 02:39:21 pm »
Pffft, Mr Universe. You have noticed that her right hand sword is now nearly to the arm.

Dresden Files had a long speech about exactly this topic.  Yea, found it.

Quote from: TurnCoat
Here's something a lot of people don't know: being choked unconscious hurts.
There's this horrible, crushing pain on your neck, followed by an almost instant surge of terrible pressure that feels like it's going to blow your head to tiny pieces from the inside. That's the blood that's being trapped in your brain. The pain surges and ebbs in time with your heartbeat, which is probably racing.
It doesn't matter if you're a waifish supermodel or a steroid-popping professional wrestler, because it isn't an issue of strength or willpower?it's simple physiology. If you're human and you need to breathe, you're going down. A properly applied choke will take you from feisty to unconscious in four or five seconds.
Of course, if the choker wants to make the victim hurt more, they can be sloppy about the choke, make it take longer.
I'll let you guess which the skinwalker preferred.

Basically, even if you're super strong, squeezing a neck isn't the easiest thing to do.

I think this warden is one of these people with a pet theory. The thing is, social Darwinism is a load of crap. At this point, she's just making a load of rationalizations.
Supposedly, Bern was only strong if she had "moral adaptability" and was "willing to get her hands dirty." Next supposedly, Polly made a bad choice by making her sacrifice for her, and she had no chance of winning. Okay, so what about that theory, hmmmm?

In this last chapter, while keeping her principles, she's managed to defeat two people just by blocking. She's screwed up his sword when supposedly it was "over" for her. And she cut his arm off like nothing.  Warden, meanwhile, has been consistently wrong so far but still manages to spew out cynical garbage, and act like it's the truth.

There will always be people who feel its their duty to "educate" the "dreamers" of the world about "reality." (In fact, this was the whole plot of Tomorrowland) Maybe you don't know reality as well as you think you do?

Maybe "that's the way things are" or maybe things are that way because people don't work together to fix things. Maybe because people don't do anything to help people who are struggling that we all have to struggle and fight and compete with other in this world? Warden is okay (helped her with the swords and getting into the match), but if she dropped this nonsense, she could be part of the solution as to making this place decent. People pay their dues, are willing to entertain, the audience gets their entertainment, but this place doesn't need to be the hellhole that it is.

Also, the author apparently doesn't understand medicine. Heart wounds are not automatically fatal.

You Have a 1 in 3 Chance of Surviving Getting Stabbed in the Heart

33% survival rate is good odds.

Compare that to gut wounds.

Kidney wounds can cause rather quick unconsciousness (in a few seconds, and death within the minute), because they mess with blood pressure and cause anaphylactic shock, and that's just one organ there. To say nothing of blood loss.

Thrashing around, as she's likely to do while choking, she'd probably hit his arm by accident (the other sword is already touching him). I have no idea how she figures things are already over. There's still life in her and all she has to do is whack his arm, while her opponent is bleeding to death.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 27, 2015, 04:59:42 pm »
I dunno that seems weird. Why talk about someone for 43 chapters and just throw them away? That makes no sense.

Polly is the sorta character the lot of us could say that about, since she's gotten maybe 5 chapters of development, but Bern is kinda like Beckett in Castle. The story makes little sense if she's gone, except as a revenge tale. In fact, I think at one point, the author labels it as a story of two women.

I find it sorta funny that the comic is delayed until tomorrow. Normally when you choke someone, it's extended for a period of time until either the hold is broken or the person passes out. So it's sorta like deciding what to do about the neck, and we're waiting for the author to stop choking her.

I don't believe he has the strength left to crush her throat. But she could easily wake up the victor, instead of finishing stuff.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 27, 2015, 12:12:55 pm »
    What bother me about this situation is if she could read his quick strikes with the pole arm weapon remains how did she not read he was dropping his weapon and going for a grab? Even in this position she has multiple escape options, or at least given how badly injured the man is.

    I saw earlier a mention of a push off from his chest motion she could do, which seems likely, but really all she has to to do is stab him with the swords repeatedly... he only has one arm after all.

    Being choked certainly isn't the end of a fight, and a stab wound of that caliber (he had at least 6+ inches of steel in his gut, it is bound to have hit something vital). Granted in a world of magic I suppose "being realistic" is up to interpretation. Even simply hitting his arm with her swords, to inflict cuts along it or perhaps even severing it, isn't farfetched considering she already cut his arm off with just one of the swords.

Reading attacks is not the same as being ready for all counters. Also, you've obviously not been trained in any martial arts.

Sword 1 outside-blocks the club or whatever, sword 2 stabs. The thing about an outside block is that the arm is --> while he simply dropped the weapon and moved out of position to do a grab. This means for her right hand to attack, she has to sweep across her body from low-mid outside to high center, while having little breathing space in her lungs to work with. The other arm has just been out of his chest, and in a weird position to block.  The most effective thing she could do is aim sword 2 slightly upward for a light stab, and kick with both feet. This would instantly break his hold, and knock him over. Or an inside block with the hand that just struck him to knock his hand away.

If she dies, I think alot of us would give up on this story. Not to mention, since she's May's love interest, it would kinda mess up the entire plot.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 25, 2015, 06:19:13 am »
Good lord.  :o Stop it man, enough is enough.

Or pass out. He has a bound up left hand, chest shrapnel (or whatever that was), and a gut wound.

Currently at this range, she has about four moves.
  • Stomach launch, basically putting one or both legs at his stomach to push him back.
  • Scissors his arm. He'll never fight again without serious improvising or prosthesis.
  • Scissors his head. Unless she's deciding now is a good time to cross that line
  • Groin kick. I think I saw him wearing a rather large codpiece though, so maybe that's out. It would be "super effective" though.

This reminds me of an episode of Beet the Vandel Buster, a lesser known anime in some circles.

They fight Grunide, this monster who spent his life containing his rage and his power. Anyway, he goes berserk, and they can't beat him (because he's using his actual rage to regenerate) until they do a completely crazy teamwork attack that cuts his horn. This is supposed to stop him as the horn is the source of power for the Vandels. But he sorta final attacks after the final strike and they're caught off guard. All it takes is a last push, of Beet using his magic to touch him with his hand on fire, and he falls back (of course, after that he explodes and they have to run for the hills).

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 23, 2015, 04:54:31 pm »
(I'm a transwoman, early transition, but thank you. I think I relate to Bern alot because she's sorta a "gruff" quiet woman)

Her. It smacked of abuse but it happening at the same day this came out completely soured my view of the comic. It felt like Bern won against me. It took much of the day to realize that I was looking at this wrong, and while I am certainly flawed, she didn't know me past a few weeks. After taking a better look at myself, I was able to "counter" my initial assessment.

Urgh, I do not want to talk about that. The degrading part isn't even the worst part, it was like zero privacy, so I'd get phone calls in the middle of the night, or while I was with my parents. Most of them would only agree if I gave them my address (refused), so 2/3 of it was time wasters, and most of the rest either were trying to scam/lowball or such freaks I didn't want to do anything with them.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 22, 2015, 04:20:32 pm »
Each to his own Miss Briefs... but I personally like seeing Bernedette on the offensive for once! :)

Guess he underestimated her will to not be underated.  If that blow was fatal.. he possibly still could be saved with magic... {shrug}...

I don't think the big guy was a bully.. he never gloated over any hit he made on her .. he saw her as a true challenge for his skill and power someone who had finally pushed him to his limits... and beyond.  If he survives... there is no reason they might not be friends.

That looks like not a heart wound but a blow to the stomach. If he calls it quits here, he can probably get healing in time. If not, depending on whether it hit major organs, could be fatal.

There are different types of bullies, actually. A bully is a person who does one of two things, usually.
  • They abuse others in some way.
  • They force others to do something they don't want to do.

Yes, he does see her as a worthy opponent. However, did he force her to do something? Yes. By keeping going for his stupid pride, he effectively is forcing her to consider lethal action, something that is disgusting to her. Now let's talk about the other category.

There are 6 major types of abuse, aside from self-inflicted like drug abuse:

  • Physical
  • Economic
  • Verbal
  • Emotional
  • Mental
  • Sexual

Pushing you into a corner, and making you feel like you're betraying yourself, is likely mental or emotional abuse. I'm not sure. Anyway, I'm feeling a little better about this comic, I was having a really crappy day (a friend that I work together with basically told me I'm worthless or something, and it was tied to work so I was left in the lurch. I couldn't really enjoy this comic until late in the afternoon).

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 22, 2015, 04:50:49 am »
Guys, I'm not sure I can keep reading this comic. I should be thrilled for Bern, but... I'm not.

I'm not really cheering for the other guy, either, because he's a bully. I just plain hate this battle, and that it's dragging on like this.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 20, 2015, 05:30:12 pm »
She's not so much "thinking she knows what he's gonna do," so much as watching his body movements. As long as she keeps her eye on him, and moves her sword, even if he tries to fake her out, she can still react. That's what reading an enemy is. That said, she picked an awfully late time to start, since she needs to simultaneously figure out how best to use the swords, while reading him, meaning even if his movements are correctly predicted, if she moves her swords wrong, it could blow up in her face.

I think she should adjust her style to block with the back sword, and dodge his weapon at the last second with the leading sword (throwing all the force into the blocking sword. It is probably easier to add power late than pull punches at the last second. If she can randomly alternate which sword blocks, she keeps him guessing and has an advantage.

I was on TvTropes on the FlipSide page, and I saw this. Kinda cracked me up.

May is Maytag Month.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 18, 2015, 11:24:43 am »
So Bern's worked out his current tactic - now to work out a counter. I wonder if she could use one blade to halt the progress of the remainder of his weapon while using the other to cut off the stub, thus leaving him with the hilt only, and in subsequent moves progressively shorten the hilt?

At that point, she'd almost certainly need to bash his forehead with the flat of her blades to knock him out, as in hand-to-hand combat his size would have a huge advantage over her.

Anyone else feeling a whole Yin-Yang vibe here? The more we want Bern to adapt here, the more he instead adapts. The more we want her to find a way to counter, the more she does. Not to mention the whole twin swords thing, and her being defense/him being attack.

Couldn't she lead with one sword, extending it out to block the attack, and sweep with the other? Urgh, but it's not her strength, it's his! I would call leading with the sword a good technique (blocks both, and he has to make a new attack), except that it probably always takes the last sword attack into account.

In all likelihood, option two is a no-go, since it seems like the swords are not designed to use her strength, they absorb kinetic energy from their target. In all likelihood, if she attacks first, they might deal no damage. Which would be disastrous, as it would tell an already savvy fighter way too much about her.

Option 1 would be a good option, but for the fact that she currently has a bum leg and can't do her patented perfect dodge.

Since both options are out, option 3 would be psychological warfare! Use the fact that he seems to be fixated on his pride and being a winner to egg him on into attacking with force. If he does something sloppy because he gets mad or impatient, he's basically defeated himself. That said, I have never seen Bern use psychological warfare, and I'm not sure she even knows how to taunt.

Alternatively, she learns to study him and figure out his attacks. And block one handed. Given that it's his force, she doesn't likely need more than that, so she can use the other to multitask, countering only when he uses force. It might slow things to a crawl however, so she she use her time to figure out his style.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 18, 2015, 03:36:17 am »
Or just hand over hand scissors attack (they seem to charge the other when the one blocks, so she could probably keep cutting) until the guy has nothing left to hold. Then kick him in the balls, and walk off.  ;D

(Alternatively, once he loses his weapon because he's extending forward he's off balance, and she can just pull her weapon back and hit tennis racquet style with the flat of her sword)

That will put a quick end to his "pride".

In terms of size advantage, basically as we picked up from that punch, any attack he throws is converted into energy. Sorta Kirby Right Back At Ya deal going on (sorry, all I could think of at the moment). The big advantage he has now over her is reach, he has  one fist and one staff, and he could potentially switch things up to play with her ability to dodge. The fact that the weapon is now a stub works in his favor too, as attack can come from virtually any direction. Hands and feet have a predictable reach gap where they overlap at different points, giving her advantage.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 16, 2015, 04:50:14 pm »
In all likelihood, the criminal justice system is run by three different corporations:

The entertainment industry vso to speak (remember those three things she could do?)

The arena.

And the prison.

All three are effectively money making operations, as in, the prison system reduces marks, but the real goal is the work program. The workers are working effectively for free, the owner is making all the profit (it might even be rigged so food and board adds marks). We've seen the arena and the sort of emotional pressure they can exrt on people. And the entertainment industry is kinda sick.

In other words, warden probably was like "just one battle and you're free" to these guys. These guys are probably in a bad position because they are too strong for weaker but too weak for S rank, so theyre stuck. So they entered the battle thinking it was a way out, but the warden placed odds on her. Best  thing that can happen is that this guy can wake her up to that this whole thing is a rigged game, and they can put their heads together.

Nah, screw it. This guy talks about pride. But how can you talk about pride, when you think lethal force, and three against one are decent tactics? That you use cheap garbage like kicking sand in people's faces? If this were a cooking competition, and they spiked the food, would they call these winners? Or cheaters? Bern's pride comes from her friends. Her family. And faith in her skill and her standards. Her pride is precisely what won't allow her to sink to his level. And she'll win, fair and square (the swords seem cheap, but they are only as good as she is). Whatever feints or deceptions he uses, she'll shrug them off and keep going. They may be alot alike. But she can do this, and I believe in her.  She can talk to this guy after she's defeated him.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 13, 2015, 05:04:38 pm »

That went over my head, sorry. Brion is cool. I've texted him by email before.

Here's my take.

You guys all said, "this is a deus ex machina" weapon, and cheap win, cheap win. But it's not. The actual struggle is within Bern herself.

Think of Bern in modern terms. Bern is like someone who in today's society would refuse to compete with others on the grounds that somewhere, someone is more deserving of that job, and probably would starve without it. So in a competitive work environment, they always lose. Nevermind that they may actually be the most deserving, the only way it happens is in a super-corporation that hires tons of people, and they work to keep their job (results may vary). Now, you have outsiders looking in at her, and they're like "she has no guts" or that she expects a job to fall into her lap. Nah, it's not like this.

Bern is a pacifist. She doesn't mind cutting off arms, because a person can still technically live with just one arm. But she wants to, if at all possible (maybe not), avoid seriously hurting people. She also can't stand the idea of competing gladiator style. That said, I don't pin her as a morally stupid person. She'd be (mostly) okay with someone else doing killing, it's her personal oath. She also would be okay with fighting as cooperation, as in, if she could talk the thug in front of her into it, it possibly wouldn't matter that he is the worst sort of criminal. She would work with him to try to escape this place.

Bern needs to adapt to survive, same as the thug. However, she wants to do it without compromising her dearly-held beliefs. So she will need to adjust her fighting style to win without being ashamed later. This is why this battle is taking a long time, despite having a powerful sword, she has the mentality of Kenshin Himura, without a sword that automatically is blunt edged. Given that the swords seem to absorb somehow, maybe using moves that are simultaneous attack and blocks will be effective. Or something else. Bern will need to do what she needs to to survive. But I do not believe this is what she needs to, or Bern would be a warrior like everyone else. Bern is Bern.


Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 13, 2015, 03:38:01 am »
But here's the thing. We've adapted to culture past the Code of Hammurabi. Most of us don't even know that culture existed. I wear the hamsa however, which dates back to around this era (along with its ties to, well, practically every religion including Islam, Judaism, Buddhism).

At the very least, we have heard from Gandhi and others "an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."

Okay, sure, people like this guy can try to satisfy their blood debts. And that's fine, this is a free world.

But being a free world, isn't the hope we live for that people don't have to live like this? That Bern has a choice? That's what she's fighting for. Heh, a warrior for kindness.

That said, Bern's gone from frightened to pissed. Look at the very beginning of this battle and this. Likely she's gonna knock him across the room.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 09, 2015, 04:23:29 pm »

I guess next limbs will come off and flipside will go all monty python black knight on us.

Bit late for that. Both Mr. I-Beam and Yo-yo girl lost an arm already.

As for the "murder is wrong" thing. Murder is ALWAYS wrong. No exceptions. The death penalty is NOT murder.

You, uhhh just made one. By putting a fancy label on a word. Tell me, what is the difference between murder in revenge, sentencing someone to death through court proceedings, and killing in war? Not much. Someone was alive and had something going for them. Now they're dead, and their story is over. You've killed them.

Fact: the same physical action is employed for all three occasions, war, justice, or murder. There is fundamentally no difference besides the words. "I want you dead" vs "You are guilty, and sentenced to death" vs "It's war, so you have to die because you're the enemy." You can kill someone or you can spare them. But be honest about it.

 It is the taking of a guilty criminal's life as punishment for a specific crime, and all the way back to the code of Hamurabi, rape is an offense that warrants the death penalty. Even the second commandment specifically allows for the death penalty. "He who sheds innocent blood shall be slain by human hands."

No it doesn't. The original 10 commandments do not state this. This is the Mosaic Code. Last I checked, we neither care about women wearing the pants of men, nor kosher diet, nor mixing fibers in clothing. This law is not directly tied to the 10 commandments, and even if it was, this is a rationalization. A person shall be slain by human hands, mebbe. But it never said they must. It is also written "vengeance is mine." Bern very much has a choice in the matter.

The death penalty requires a little something called "due process." That is, bringing forth evidence, witnesses and delivering judgement from a higher power. A man running up and killing someone because he THINKS (or "knows") a guy raped his daughter would be homicide, a lesser form of murder, and could itself be punishable by death.

Self-defense is not murder. Someone breaks into your house, he's not there to deliver a check from Ed Mc Mahon. He's there to steal, KILL, and destroy. You still don't get to chase him down and kill him if he flees, however. Someone comes at you with a weapon, and you fight back, resulting in his death, it's not murder.

Because something is reasonable (and yes you have this right) does not make it the only option. A guy breaks into your house, you can club him until he leaves, or sic dogs on him.

Soldiers killing enemy soldiers on the battlefield is not murder. It's war. And both armies are fighting to survive. Combatants firing rockets into a civilian dwelling, or deliberately targeting unarmed non-combatants IS murder.

Again, you have delusions that there is a dinstinction. Call things by their proper name.

Extremists running into a civilian establishment seeking to kill as many people as possible is not "holy." It's murder. Even if they try to "justify" it by claiming "provocation" afterwards, by pointing to a set of "laws" that isn't even written down. (The Koran does NOT say "go forth and kill everyone who utters the name mohammad, or dares draw a picture of his likeness," for example.)

Muslims believe that they are at war, and civilians are a threat to their way of life. They will have children who they will teach their way of life. Either realize that war is evil, but something you do in hopes that future generations will benefit, or stop kipping yourself and do not go to war.

As for Bern's options? She's already cut off his arm and left deep gashes in his chest, and he keeps coming! (Not to mention destroying his weapon.)

Also, remember her style is almost exclusively counter attacks. It is very difficult for her to do anything preemptive.

He's also extremely "proud," determined, and believes he has a license to kill, or die trying. Bern's in a really hard place right now, and I don't envy her for a moment.

And for once this entire post, I agree.

If he goes black knight, I'm probably changing the channel. "It's just a flesh wound."

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 08, 2015, 04:46:25 am »
Bern is actually way more black and white than I am. I'm just incredibly stubborn and stuff I disagree with, I really really hate. Not so much because it's wrong but because it's wrong for me. Which frankly, is all something needs to be to reject it anyway.  The reason Bloody Mary is a monster not because she hurt someone she cared about. It's because of her fighting style. Bern explained this. Humans use weapons. Monsters use teeth and claws. She wasnt calling her a "monster" she was stating a fact, her blade deals with beasts differently.  Because they have different physiology and cutting one up is a bit more okay.

Yes bern is "off balance" (pffft), but she's loads cooler than the knight with the eyepiece. She doesn't tend to make judgement calls on the rest of humanity, her morality seems strictly self centered. As in, aside from wanting exclusive relationship, May could go have orgies, but she sits that out. Which is precisely why she'd get jealous, she doesn't give herself the same rights as she gives others.

In terms of Polly, I don't think she has had time to look around, you know?  Not when some guy is attacking and won't let you have a moments peace to just look around and see stuff. She won't bend and break because this situation is actively encouraging her to do stuff unpleasant, like murder.

Aversion to murder does not have to be a black and white mentality. You could run into people who say murder is wrong "except" if they rape my daughter. But there you go. That's making exceptions. To me, the idea of someone making me into something I'mnot, yea it makes me throw up inside my mouth. And if their intent were to make me into some violent killer, it would not be "rigid" morality to want to stand firm against this crap, it would be something baser like disgust. I'm not sinking to this level, even if they manage to kill me. She has to find a good "disable all" technique that simply takes him out of the battle without letal force. Or just kill his sword and punch him out.

Actually, I wouldn't want to see her cheat, either. But I do want to see her facing her problem of seeing things in absolute black and whites.  Nude art must be something sexual (and therefore bad?!).  Bloody Mary hurt someone I cared about, so she must be a Monster.  I'd have to re-read to see what she thinks of cheating - I kind of remember her saying she knew about Maytag cheating on her but stayed with her anyway, during Suspira's bitchy spell reveal moment - but I still get a sense of Bernadette's character being very righteously judgemental sometimes, in a bad way.  I like that she's committed to being a "good person" by however she defines that standard.  There seem to be too few of those in this comic, of the main characters who seem to give off the vibe of wanting to actively be "good guys" I count Bernadette and Crest.  I thought rejecting her dream of becoming a knight to stay with Maytag was a real step in the direction of character growth, away from those judgemental tendencies.  But I haven't seen that sort of growth re: her attitude towards sexuality.  It's complicated I guess - I want to see Bernadette becoming more open-minded and forgiving, but I don't want to see her lose her core values or suddenly be down with engaging in a threesome or whatever.

I don't see that sort of interesting personal growth happening in this arena arc.  If anything, the whole "I can't bend or break!" declaration while Polly was going to the wall for her over there really annoys me.  As I said before, why wasn't she like that in the cell?  It's almost hypocritical to find her resolve now.  When she was fighting Elvis in that enchanted castle, she was ready to give up and die (and let Maytag and the others die too) because her fighting style didn't work, rather than lower her standards and use other people as meatshields to win.  Here, she's a different person.  All she does is lose a little sleep, shed a few guilty tears and get saved by her dad's magic swords, which was apparently all it took to recover her confidence.  I haven't even got the sense that she's taking into account Polly's human shielding, as if she forgot about all of that now that she has the swords.   Of course this chapter isn't over yet, so hopefully I will be eating my words later on.  But I'm still not a happy camper yet.  :P

You totally need to sing this song (from the Sleepaway Camp series)

As I see it, Bern has a few perfectly viable nonlethal options. I dunno why this fight is dragging on so long, besides that she's off her game.

  • She can hamstring him. She doesn't need to cut through the legs to do this, just the joints or whatever.
  • She can knock him out with the flat of her sword. Best option, as it means he can viably  challenge other people.
  • She can block and push, knocking him against the wall.
  • She can break his sword, then punch him out.
  • Kick him hard in the balls.
  • She can break his sword and cut his fingers.

All of these will end the battle without making him die afterwards.

Yeah, I appreciate keeping one's ethics. But she needs to stop dragging her feet and end this before he forces her to do something rash.

Flipside Discussion / Re: Chapter 43: Discussion
« on: May 06, 2015, 05:01:17 am »
Yeah, and the really funny thing is, Bern doesn't appear to have pride, warrior or otherwise.  ;D She just fights to stay alive, and defend others.

So it's kinda a contest between big time A/S rank guy who can't let it go that she's beating him, and small time Bern who just wants to go home and doesn't really care if she wins or loses.

Bern's not a warrior.  She's a knight.  A protector.  Knight doesn't equal warrior.

I said that. In my earlier post (that mods saw fit to collapse rather than simply asking me to change)1.

Bern is a knight, so she's not suited for this life. So yea, she doesn't care about warrior pride. And doesn't need to adapt.

As to the other post, I think he's just making up excuses. Swallow your pride, say "okay, it's not really working" and call it a day.

I think the whole "cheat/don't cheat" thing is an example of the very black and white morality that we are criticizing her for. She should talk to Maytag, and they should face this together. Maybe Maytag is okay with an exclusive deal, maybe it'll break the thing up (tad hypocritical), maybe it would be a reason to reconsider the stance on an open relationship. Their love is still developing and growing, and it might be something they can discuss.

I uh might need to ask copyright permission so that I can print this picture out. And place it by my bed. And uhhhh....

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